info on yenko/copo's

[hotz]

hey guys:
I am looking into building a yenko/copo CLONE. I wanted to say that first so all the purest don't freak out when I ask these questions,. I am just looking into building a car with a lot of HP to have some fun in with my boyz ages 6 and 4.

First question would all yenko/copo have a X code??? the reason i ask is when I have done some reading www.holisticpage.com/camaro/camaros/copo.htm the article references that "Since these cars could be ordered by any dealer there were many more COPO's built for other dealers." Does that mean another dealer from LA could have ordered the motor and put it into a LA built car with out a x code??? Just a question. They raced these cars in CA. also right

Second question is that the article says that "The first COPO 9561 cars were delivered to Yenko Chevrolet in January, 1969." That means to me that there could be a 1969 yenko/copo car made that would have been built in the NOR plant without a X code since X codes didn't start until the second week of December. I am sure the cars that he received in January were on the production way prior to the second week of December wouldn't they???  according to www.Yenko.net. "Early cars were either X11 or X66, while cars built after March are X44."  early meaning  early in the year of 1969 not early in the production year that would have been started back in sept of 1968.? So could have some of the first 1969 copo/yenko's built been without x codes?? We know that all 67 and 68's were without x codes. That is when the x codes started right?

Third question is what crank would they have put in a copo? and is that the same as a yenko/copo?  I have read that it is the 7115 crank but, but i have also read that the 7115 was put into the ZL1 and is super hard to find. I have read that most copo/yenko cars had the 6223 crank. Along those lines the block would have been a 512 4 bolt main with 840 heads right???

Finally, could a copo motor been placed in other cars other than the ones that Don Yenko built? yenko and copo seem to be synonyous with each other. Is there any info of how many went to don yenko and how many went to other dealers? I am not a fan of the 6 colors that i have read about that Don Yenko's camaro's were.  If there are ones that don did not get could they have been any color?


Once again guys i am just asking questions and have come to the table of the all knowing for a few answers. I am looking to build a car that my boyz and I can have a good time in yet CLONE it as close as possible. Thanks for all the feed back and look forward to hearing from you.

[william]

There is no relationship between COPOs 9560/9561 and any of the X codes the Fisher Body plant used at Norwood. X codes meant nothing to Chevrolet assembly; Fisher used them to specify trim appointments for a body in process. The LA Camaro plant did not use X codes and at this time there is no hard evidence that any COPO Camaros were built there.

All COPO Camaros will have an X code on the body tag. As you noted X codes entered production Dec '68. A few weeks later the first two COPO Camaros were built: ZL-1s #1 & 2. All of Fred Gibbs' ZL-1s were X44 because they were not ordered with Style Trim Group. A few ZL-1s ordered by other dealers did have Style Trim with X11 tags.

Most of Yenkos cars were not ordered with Style Trim. The first group built for Yenko were perhaps incorrectly specified at the plant and received 396 SS trim appointments with X66 body tags; the rest had X44 tags. A very few did have Style Trim with X11 tags.

Possibly due to fleet ordering requirements Yenko [and Gibb] was limited to a few colors. Only 10 of the first 50 Yenkos were Olympic Gold; no more gold cars were built. There were far more 9561 Camaros built for other dealers and all colors were available. In addition several COPO Camaros were built in non-RPO colors. One dealer in Ohio had a COPO created for a special hood stripe.

No one knows exactly how many 9561 Camaros were built. The Tonawanda engine plant did maintain records: 822 MN and 193 MO 427 engines were produced. Not all were used in production so maybe 900-950 9561 cars were built. Yenko received 198 or 201 Camaros depending on who you ask. The records that survive are handwritten and hard to read.

COPO 9561 included the L72 427 engine. It was equipped with standard HP BB rods with 3/8" bolts and used the production crankshaft. The ZL-1 [and L-88] used HP rods with 7/16" bolts requiring a crank balanced to compensate for the additional weight of the bolts.

http://www.camaros.org/copo.shtml

[hotz]

Thank you William!!!! You have answered a lot of my questions. I enjoyed the article you referenced and after reading it is sounds like I want to build the L72  ( or the 9561 coop) with the Iron block. 427/435 motor. Sounds like the L72 was a production car as well as a replacement block
.  Just a few more questions. 
would it have been a x11 or x44 car as well like the 9560 copo? 
with a 512 block (ending 3 numbers) 4 bolt main?
840 heads?
What crank?
Would these cars also followed the production line as the 9560 copo staring in december of 68 for the  69 year?

Thanks for your imput again

[william]

Both COPOs were built with [X11] and without [X44] the Style Trim option. So it is your preference.

'69 L72 engines had a 4 bolt main 512 block, 840 heads, standard steel crank. Around June '69 the 291 casting replaced the 840.

The earliest known COPO 9561 Camaro was built the second week of January '69. Wasn't a Yenko BTW.

[JoeC]

On the Yenko production numbers 198 and 201 - they both came from the same person - Vince E who has the original Yenko records.
He first said his info showed 201 but changed it to 198 after finding that 3 cars were not delivered. This was back in the mid 1980s
I don't know why the 201 number is still used 25 years after it was corrected.

None of the Yenko production numbers may be exact as the Yenko records are not exact but the 198 number is based on Vince E's records and the 201 number has no basis

[bcmiller]

What crank?

Most likely it was the 6223 crank. 

[Rich69s]

Old thread I know but I am new here. This goes to  Williams  comment about the first  COPO  build date of the second week of January  and not  being a Yenko . I have a 69 Yenko with a  1 B build date verified by Vince. How do add pics, I'd be glad to show you.
 Rich

[MO]

I don't see where William said when the first COPO was built.

[Rich69s]

Five rows up, bottom line.

[cook_dw]

I use photobucket.com

Here is a quick down and dirty way of how I upload pictures.

Once you create an account you will have the option to upload pictures.  Click the UPLOAD tab.







It will take you to this screen to allow you to download pictures from your pc to photobucket.







Now you have them downloaded click whichever picture you want to add to a thread here or any forum.







On the right hand side you will see options to copy the url address for posting pictures.  Click on "IMG" url and it should say "copied"; if not then just highlight all the url and then right click and copy.







Now that you have the url copied just simply add it to a reply and hit "post".  You can also "preview" you post before just to make sure you have added it correctly.







Hopefully this helps.

[JohnZ]

It's a lot easier to just upload images directly from your computer - use the "Choose File" button below the window you type in, and use "more attachments" if you need to upload more than one image (you can upload a max of four per post), and each must be below 150KB.   

[Rich69s]

Thank you all for your help. I tried cropping and loading from my I Pad in the test area but it comes back file size too large. The pics were also taken on the I Pad but I do not know how to restrict there size. I must say that I am surprised by the number of members that have more then one first gen Camaro.

   

[cook_dw]

It's a lot easier to just upload images directly from your computer - use the "Choose File" button below the window you type in, and use "more attachments" if you need to upload more than one image (you can upload a max of four per post), and each must be below 150KB.   

Size is the problem. 

[william]

I don't see where William said when the first COPO was built.

That would be the first COPO 9561 Camaro. It should be noted that there has always been controversy surrounding it because the "paperwork" was manually typed. Its VIN is just prior to the 1st Yenko.

[MyRed67]

Old thread I know but I am new here. This goes to  Williams  comment about the first  COPO  build date of the second week of January  and not  being a Yenko . I have a 69 Yenko with a  1 B build date verified by Vince. How do add pics, I'd be glad to show you.
 Rich  

Welcome Rich, and congrats on the car!  You will find that the build date on the Cowl Tag is the date the car was started.  Info. here:
http://camaros.org/numbers.shtml#CowlTag
Also, if your car is a 1 B build and a Yenko, it simply means it was built the same week as the one William spoke of.  And I think what William is saying is that the one he is talking about is the first one documented to this point.   It will have to be sorted out by VIN. if it was before or after.  They are always open to new info. here, if it can be documented.  That is what we're here for.