barrett jackson las vegas Z-28

[GaryL]

The trim tag and vin number tag and paperwork is real.  I flagged the drive train as a restoration drive train in the report on the car.  I am not at liberty to post reports to the public or on a public forum.  This car was also judged at the Camaro Nationals this past summer in the "Bow Tie" class and scored a silver.  Car was nicely done but there were a lot of little things.  I can't believe that someone paid that much for the car with a resto drive train.  The X-ram and carbs were real though.  

Jerry  

It sounds like you missed the fact the car is a re-body!

oops.

you shoulkd chime in here soon.your absence looks fishy.

Get a life idiot. Take it somewhere else.

[Gramps69Z]

Gary, there's no reason to be ugly here.  The man just asked a question.  The bottom line on this is it's a federal offense and someone or one's in trouble.   There's a lot more talk on Team Camaro and the Yenko site, and it's not edited.

[tom]

The only thing that seems fishy here is the rash of opioniated newbies

[Charley]

Some of you act like it is a simple thing to spot a rebody. Jerry does a inspection. He can't be pulling heater boxes etc looking t see if hidden vins have been tampered with unless he is hired to. I don't know how Jerry's certs are written but the COPO Connection certs certified the vin, not the body. There will always be re-bodys that get by just because they are too easy to hide. It is tte history like on this car that sniffs them out.

[L78 steve]

Then certs. are worthless !

[sd1968z28]

when jerry certified my car he looked at all the numbers stamped on the shell.  there are lots of other numbers stamped all over the body.  i am sure if these were missing he would have noticed it?  this is all a little smelly in my book!

[Hylton]

Man, would I love to strip and dip this car!

[GaryL]

Sorry Fireman. Have to disagree. He asked no questions at all. Everything was his opinion. He has no established integrity here to call anyone on the carpet. He actually quoted JM. JM hit the nail on the head. Resto drivetarin does not equal $100K. Either the seller hid the certification or the buyer ignored it. Who is to blame?

How can someone verfy 100% if a cowl VIN was welded in without destructive testing. Anyone willing to do that on a whim? If the experts here tell me the TT looks good and the rivets look good how far am I willing to go. Remember nothing made a Z/28 except parts bolted on. A body is a body. Personally for $100K I would dig a little deeper.

[KurtS]

I think Charley (and GaryL) summed it up pretty well.
With a completely assembed car, it's hard to verify the body is original. If it's done right, it can be hard to tell on a primed shell, no less a completed car.

Jerry has been traveling. I'm not sure what else he would add anyway. He told you what he found. Anything more detailed would be in the report, which is between him and the person who had the appraisal done.

I edited per Gary's request. He was able to edit his own posts on TC.

The only thing that seems fishy here is the rash of opioniated newbies

So noted.....

[JL8Jeff]

It's real easy now to say I would dig deeper, but if you were the buyer and you had not heard anything questionable about the car, why would you feel the need to dig deeper?  A certification can't prove if the hidden VIN section of metal was replaced because he can't scrape the paint off to inspect the area for welding.  A certification is to prove that all the documents, drivetrain, tags and parts add up to what the car is claimed to be.  It's not about the body itself unless the seller is willing to have the car taken apart and paint stripped off to inspect the hidden VIN area.  

[JoeC]

Maybe we can take away an important lesson from all this.

Have the car checked before it is restored and/or take a lot of pictures during resto.
Take pictures of stripped vin area, tag area, all dates anywhere you can find them during resto.

Same with engine block. In a restored car a deck stamp can look pretty good but with the head off it can show an obvious decked block.

If you have a original stamped un-decked block, be sure to take pictues of the uncut deck with head off.

Take pictures of the sheet metal dates, crankshaft date code, rear end gears, etc. anything and everything you can find. It can't hurt.

[tom]

No, it can't hurt. However a picture of the hidden VIN (for example) could be taken of the original car, and included with the documentation for the car. Chances of somebody pulling the heater box to verify it prior to purchase are slim. There is nothing that can not be faked. That includes paperwork, stampings, hidden VIN's etc. A paper trail, good documentation, inspection by an expert will all reduce the chances of fraud. It can still happen.

I am very thankful for the expertise, and resources on this site. I am also feeling better and better about only having a plain old 307 glide. Nobody is going out of their way to fake those. At least not yet.

[666 the legend]

.Where exactly is the VIN by the heater box..?? Inside the firewall or outside.. Pics..??

[1968RSZ28]

.Where exactly is the VIN by the heater box..?? Inside the firewall or outside.. Pics..??

Outside.  Read this...  http://www.camaros.org/numbers.shtml#PartialVIN

Paul

[666 the legend]

....Thankyou....