Service Engines (CE coded)

[ZLP955]

From another thread here, a member sent me the pictures below, of a CE block with the following dates:
Pad Stamp: CE9A24283
Casting Number: 3932386
Casting Date: J 12 8





This was very interesting for me, because the assembly stamp is only 5 numbers earlier than a CE block that I have, with the following numbers:
Assembly Stamp: CE9A24288
Casting Number: 3956618
Casting Date: A 9 9





So comparing the numbers, there is approximately 3 months between casting dates (October 12, 1968 to January 9, 1969), yet the Flint assembly sequence numbers stamped on the pads are only 5 units apart.
Previous thread contributors have confirmed they have seen CE9, CE9A, CE9B and CE9C prefixes for Flint V8 assembly. Based on the block of sequential numbers allocated to that plant, this equates to over 90,000 CE blocks for the 1969 model year. With this number of service blocks, there can't have actually been a 3-month gap between 5 sequential units being machined and assembled. One possibility is that the 618 block was machined shortly after casting and the 386 casting remained on the rack until January of '69 before it was pulled out and machined just prior to the 618, but another possibility is that a quantity of raw castings was routinely set aside for CE applications, and perhaps both of these pictured were assembled some time after casting.
It would be great to get some more data points if anyone else has another block with a reasonably close assembly number.

[ko-lek-tor]

I am hesitant to contribute to this as I am as limited, as most on the site,  on warranty knowledge & understanding. I hate to not be factual and rely on hearsay, but I was told many years ago that over the counter and warranty engines were engines that did not pass test firing off the line and were set aside for further repair. I was told that repaired engines were used in warranty. Left over unrepaired engines/short blocks were sold as over the counter engines. The guy that told me this was like a big brother to me and I looked up to him. He still has his SS 454 Chevelle he bought new and a couple of crate LS7s he bought in 73. It was while going through one of those 454s right out of the crate that my friend showed me that it had 3 broken rings! This led to my understanding that there must be some truth to what he said.

[x77-69z28]

That's interesting Bentley, as my engine builder told me the same thing. The CE engine in my 70Z is currently being redone, and according to my engine guy, there are several things out of spec. I do have the replacement Protect-O-Plate with it.
Buddy

[ZLP955]

Buddy do you have a P-o-P that reflects your car being fitted with a CE under warranty?

[x77-69z28]

It is an all aluminum blank, no tape. It has the original owners info, but since the short block was changed, no info about thestampings of the drivetrain.

[69Z28-RS]

It is an all aluminum blank, no tape. It has the original owners info, but since the short block was changed, no info about thestampings of the drivetrain.

I don't understand why a dealership would do that..  provide a 'blank' protecto-plate in the event of a warranty replacement engine?   the VIN information and trans and rear etc information would still be correct for warranty purposes... The CE information on the replacement block would even allow warranty service on that engine within the warranty period...  Buddy:  that doesn't sound right....??

I have a '69 Corvette for which I know it's entire history from day 1.  The original owner blew the engine within 2 weeks (street racing), and took it in for service which required a new warranty short block (350/350 engine).. the CE engine casting is dated within a few days of when the original engine was blown up.  All of this happened within a month of production and delivery of the car.  I have the original protecto-plate with ALL of the original information (including the original owners data and the original car/drivetrain into - obviously the engine info was outdated by the CE replacement).    This situation would verify that there would be no reason to 'replace the P-t-P', and also verifies that the replacement engine was 'cast/built' extremely close - within days- of the Need for Replacement ...

Of course, like anything else... there are sure to be exceptions.. 

[bcmiller]

I believe replacement POPs were normally issued by dealers when a car was sold to another person, but still covered by warranty. The complete drivetrain information was not stamped (since not done at the factory) and the book itself did not get the VIN holes in the book. That's as far as I know.

CE engines were built on weekends or on overtime, as far as I know. bergy or others may be able to confirm.

I can't confirm or deny that they were built from engines that failed inspection or were set aside.

Go back to the second post in this thread, to see what JohnZ said. 

[bcmiller]

I have a 1974 - 327 CE shortblock, casting number 3959512, with large journal forged crank and has provisions for road draft tube. It's all standard bore, standard rods and mains.

My November 68 dated L72 shortblock (3963512 casting) with dimple rods and 6223 crank is bored 0.040 but I don't think it's all original. Rods and mains are standard.

[x77-69z28]

I will take a picture of it, if someone wants to post it.

[KurtS]

CE blocks were scheduled, just like other block builds. They would switch over to the various part #'s as required.

[ZLP955]

Kurt, do you mean they were scheduled on demand, or scheduled in batches for inventory? I recall a much older thread where JohnZ (IIRC) said that CE assemblies were scheduled on weekends because they couldn't be handled in the same way as fully dressed production line engines, but he also mentioned that they were assembled according to GM forecast requirements.

[69Z28-RS]

THAT would explain why some seemed to be built per need, and yet some had a delay between build and usage...

[bcmiller]

Here is the one I mentioned.  Can't remember if I ever posted this one before.  Cast in September 1973.  3959512 casting number, which was commonly used for warranty/service blocks.

[KurtS]

Scheduled means it was a planned for event. They weren't using rejects (those were either repaired or scrapped) or partial production blocks....
I can't fathom that they wouldn't have some of the more common blocks in inventory somewhere. When your customer's block fails, you can't wait for them to build and ship a new one....

[ZLP955]

The owner of the block with the CE9A24283 stamp above sent me some additional pictures shown below - thanks Kevin!
Still has the inspection and assembly marks on it, and looks to be a 302 based on the 1178 crank, pink 'O' rods, 2482 main caps and windage tray studs.





Does anyone know how to decode the numbers stamped near the gasket surface by the starter motor? I assume it's a date code of sorts, and that the 'V' denotes Flint engine assembly; however is it in the format month-year-plant, or day-month-plant? And is the plant code a suffix (rather than the usual pad stamp prefix), or is the stamp mirror reversed ('01 9 V' or 'V 9 10')?
What about the stamped out numbers underneath? Correction on the assembly date? Re-work?