Hours of body part install

[KERR]

So I talked to "brooks" the guy that's related to Jeff who works for me.   He didn't give me a price but quoted mr a hourly rate,   Problem is I don't know how long stuff takes.   So you all that have had 1/4s, a roof, floor etc put in did they by chance put on the bill the time it took?

I'm thinking you all are are correct on just buying the dynacore body.   I went on amd and got everything I need in the buggy, some of it I might not need, went shopping with worse case scenario  anyway it was close to $5k   

So that means labor for install would have to be about $7k to get the price of the body.   By his price "about $40.00" a hour that would around 175 hours of labor to replace all the metal

[Mark]

Theres an old mitchell insurance estimate book that gives hours for repair or replacement of most parts on the Camaro.  I have the 67 version.  Full quarter replacement is 11.4  hours for a coupe, 9.1 for a convertible, a roof is 13.9 hrs less the drip rails, drip rails are an additional 1.7 hrs if both the roof and quarters are out, 1.4 with just the roof removed.  They didn't replace floors back in 67 so theres no time estimate for that, but its probably in the high 30 hr range.

[rsr]

 I assume you've got rust? It's those unforeseen problems that pop up that must be considered as well.....I've dealt with for 38 years! What about the wheel housing and condition of the other body parts you are welding the replacement parts to? These things can eat up some time! 40.00 per hr. is a fair price to have the panels done correct....nearly 40 hrs and no floors installed..Just my opinion here and best of luck with the project.

[69Z28-RS]

I think those hour estimates are way too low, based on what I see; in 1967, a 'panel replacement' was based on collision damage, not rust.   Removing, preparing the adjoining surfaces, etc when rust (esp heavy rust as Kerr's car) is very time consuming comparied to simply cutting off a damaged panel and replacing with straight metal.   Any good shop will provide their costs/invoices showing hours; surely someone here who has had rusty panels replaced can provide some 'real world' hourly estimates.   Another good thing to do would be to *ask the fella providing the $/hr estimate, for his 'hours estimate'.   If he can't provide at least a rough estimate of the time, it indicates to me that he's never done this same type of job before.

Kerr:  175 hrs is a bit over 4 man weeks; or 2 guys for 2 weeks.  Do you think all your rusty panels could be removed and adjacent panels derusted and preserved, new panels adjusted, welded in and prepared for paint in 2 weeks by 2 guys?   I really don't think so based on what I see get accomplished in such shops.

[KERR]

Grate info guys!  i agree,   ive got most every thing removed,   i wasnt sure what else i can take apart in the garage then move the car,.


Yes ive got major rust that was covered up with new panels, then fiber glassed over,  went from a very clean looking car to a pos in about 3 days lol.

I didnt find out now that front end is gone, motor and trans out, etc... that the drivers side new floor pan is put in on top of the old one,  or where the old one should be,   i can see the remains of the old pan near the fire wall.

[Kelley W King]

unless there is a car you can look at that this guy has done all this work to I would have to think about. I have seen many friends who ended up going and getting there partially complete car after relations with the original guy fell through only to find out much of the work needed to be redone. Even though I am not much into new bodys, I would thing they were put together with some type of jig and done by people that do it everyday and have learned from past mistakes of how to do it right. Plus I think 175 hours is low. Just my opinion.

[rsr]

Sorry to hear about your project....it's a shame what some people will do to turn a quick buck! you saw the rusty floor pan from underneath before buying the car? It's always best to have an inspection done by an experienced person prior to paying for any car and not to say an experienced person could find eveything if it has been covered up.Always ask for the shop that did the work when looking at any car! As the old saying goes "buyer beware"

[Sauron327]

   A dynacorn body is not plug and play. They require mods for parts fit and panel alignment. So you'll have to add an hourly rate to the body purchase price. You are better off buying a project car that someone has started or a better shell. Entire structure assemblies can also be purchsed and all you have to do is drop on the top half.  

   Crash book prices apply to 1967 and are for GM panels on a new car back then. Repro installation base prices can increase depending on mods required.
A shop should provide a price range. Any shop that gives a set price is bound to become a problem when diving into a pile of rot. From what I recall from the photos of your car, it's pretty much toast. I tell customers to look at AMD's price guide to see what an average price can be. And these are not set in stone. http://amdinstallation.com/prices.html

   The level of quality you want greatly influences cost.

   I would strongly suggest getting references, looking at work performed by the shop and talking to their customers. I had a car shipped to me for a roof skin and tailpanel installation. New quarters were just installed by another shop but over rotten driprails and roof skin. So I had to cut the quarters off off and scrap them. The shop sold him Gmark doors and fenders that were junk. Those I replaced with GM parts.
After replacing all exterior panels on the car the customer could not afford to have me take the job to final paint. So the car was shipped 9 hours back to its home. After he had it painted the car was shipped back to me and I had to redo some of their work. More needs to be corrected but finances won't allow it. Save a penny, waste a dollar.

  Do your research.

[joesauer]

KERR.....agree with others that you would be better off finding a body shell with minimal rust & work from that to restore your car.  MY opinion (based on building 8 cars) is that the labor hours will be far in excess of what's being quoted to you (by the body shop guy).  You need someone that can fit body panels perfectly, get the gaps correct, get the edges rounded properly, etc.  If you locate a used body or clunker with minimal rust, take an expert with you to look it over for hidden problems.  Out in Calif.  some body shops or custom car builders will go with you, for a fee, and give you a true picture of what you are up against.

[1968 Z28]

Here is an alternative for comparison....http://www.realdealsteel.com/all-new-steel-1969-camaro-bodies/  You might want to search around the internet for "complete camaro body shell" and read up on the various sites that will build you a shell.  One of them found will even build you a complete rolling shell for $22,000.00.

[69Z28-RS]

$11,500 for a complete body shell from Real Deal Steal.. doesn't sound like too bad a deal... all new metal..  ready for Kerr's parts removed from the rust bucket.... If a decent original body shell cannot be found... (which I agree would be the best alternative for him)...

[67rs327]

Just got my '67 back from the body shop last Friday night. I mentioned on another thread that Kerr had started that I was working with one of the larger insurance based shops in my area (Northeast) and that they agreed to take on my project as filler work. I negotiated a rate of $45/hr. The job ended up being replacement (due to extensive rust) of the following:
1. Rear shock towers (both) - area about 18x8
2. Inner wheel arches (both)
3. Quarter size hole around rear floor drain plug
4. Quarter size hole in pan near gas tank strap mount
5. Patch both forward outer wheel arches at rocker access plugs - the holes had rusted larger in size so plugs no longer fit.

The techs were pretty skillfull and we decided not to go with a whole new trunk pan install as it was generally in good condition. However, I did buy a full pan from Summit Racing to save on fabrication time as there's quite a bit of sandwiched metal and contours in the shock tower area - so was better to cut the bad stuff out and replace with a preformed piece to minimize the weld lines. The Car will need rear quarters at some point - but I can live with them for now (that will be part of the full outer resto when I'm not hemorraging college money)

Total billed hrs was 50.5 - so a little under $2300 in labor.
So I agree with the general opinion - I think your your hrs estimate is way low. We figured initally about 20 hrs per side - but once we got going - more rust! I would easily add 25% additional labor cost to your worst case estimate.

[ko-lek-tor]

here is a candidate KERR: http://www.ebay.com/itm/Chevrolet-Camaro-X11-SS-1969-camaro-x-11-solid-builder-with-factory-fold-down-rear-seat-/121444494422?forcerrptr=true&hash=item1c46a7ec56&item=121444494422&pt=US_Cars_Trucks#ht_1184wt_1312

[69Z28-RS]

I'd prefer that one to a 'repro body', I think.. based on the description of no rust... no significant damage.   Kerr would have all the other parts to finish it... with body work, paint, and interior...

[KERR]

Good find and info guys

When I looked at the car there where only two questionable things.  The top above the windshield had a hump in it about 1 wide.  It was solid though, I pushed on it a few times and it didn't budge. It felt like a glob of glue,   Then the front fender was off a little at the grill, meaning it didn't match the other side.  From looking under the car you could see a patch panel on that front fender.    The rest of car looked good for what I had planned.   I already had figured a roof skin since the car was a vinyl top and planned on the front fender.    But what I got was a pos.

The bottom of the car was sprayed with rubber coating so it looked stock.  Only reason I noticed the floor patch was when I took the carpet out you can see it.    They put the half floor pan over the original on the inside then covered the bottom up with coating.   I haven't dug into the floor so I don't know what they patched the bottom side with.  Don't even car at this point. 

I'll take a look at that e bay car.  What scares me now that I have been screwed is buying on of those shells and it needing a lot of the parts too :-(.   Right now I'm at the point where a gas leak from pool heater and random spark would be nice. :-(

As for the body shop they do grate work. On INS claims.  We send a lot of stuff there.  The ower brooks is like us,  do what pays the bills to let you play,   He has done a tone of old car restorations in terms of body stuff.   Back in 95 when I crashed the corvette I talked to him about fixing it,  over time he got busy and o had to sue ins so it took a few years to get paid.  By that point he had moved to the next town and was covered up.  So I had the car fixed by another shop who was in town.  It worked out well for me as the owner of that shop was cutting up a 67 coupe and well I had a crashed 67 convertible.  So I got most of his old parts.  He built a tubbed 4 speed car with a big block and 1071 blower out of the hood.  Then did all custom leather.  So I took his frame, interior rear end etc and put in mine.  He has past away now and I don't trust anyone I don't know.   

What really sucks is the only way I can see ever being "ok" in this car is go back as stock as I can and putting it in the garage for years.   But since I don't have any documents other than a title and ship date I don't know if was just a 307 car or what.   I do know it's not getting a power glide put back in it lol. 

If I had any idea this car was in the shape it is I would have just gone to chevy. Put that money down on a ZL-1 financed the rest for 72 months, have about $500 car payment and beat the hell out of it and let Gm worry about broken parts lol.