Pretty Cool Ole Car

[lakeholme]

So your panties are fine as long as their is no golden parachutes, but the bail outs are a necessity?
Next we will hear how we have to get away from auto unions and how their leverage has put the big 3 behind the eight ball.....
but we know that won't happen , to big of a voting block. 

Okay, if we're going to talk politics and cars, then we need to keep up.  Read THIS. Michigan is well on its way to becoming a right to work state. And THIS, come to think of it.

[Azure1969Z/28]

Think not. Oh and GM would be out of business today if not for a bail out instituted your elected politicians.

Peace

As far as I'm concerned, GM should have went out. If my business goes bankrupt, who bails me out? Nobody. Oh, that's right, I'm not one of the "special" people who get bailed out by the taxpayer. (nor do I wish or expect to be) Politicians didn't ante up the bail out funds. They took funds from me, and millions of other tax payers.

I guess we're going to keep talking politics. If your business goes "bankrupt"  you are being "bailed out" depending on how you file you will only be responsible for a portion or none of your incurred debt and in some cases can continue to operate your business. Who pays for that? other consumers, business owners and tax payers. Unfortunately some people both conservative and liberal use this as a business model. Bail outs for big businesses are a touchy subject a lot of jobs and effects on the economy at stake, although I don't think that the "top dogs" running these failed businesses should come out of it virtually unscathed.
Did I mention that i am a fan of the "flat hood" 69 Z/28's?

We're not disagreeing..     One could remove the hood, and it still would be a Z28..
[/quote] das ist richtig !

[BULLITT65]

both good articles Phillip. Interesting how much participation VW had in trying to get a union in there. On the other hand Michigan has a long way to go, it took a number of elections voting the same ticket back into office and getting the same results, I hope if it doesn't turn around right away that they don't blame who is in power right now. Even if the right guys are in there (which time will tell) it is still going to take a major overhaul of the whole state.

"Who knew the movie "ROBOCOP" would predict the future (of Detroit) correctly 20 years from when it was released?

[HawkX66]

"Liberal Argument Playbook - Use these tactics when debating conservatives:

 1. Ignore Facts that hurt your position. When that doesn't work...
 2. Blame President Bush. When that doesn't work...
 3. Call them a racist and then run away!
   Note: If facts continue to come your way, repeat steps 1-3"

 Until the unions stop giving money to the left, they are going to continue to sink. If you give your money to a union, you are supporting the left completely right now. I see guys getting out of the union constantly because of that. Think about it if you are a union steward, president etc. Time for some union policy changes if you want to survive.
 I can't believe you guys allowed me to get into this on the internet lol. Over drinks next time ok?

[jdv69z]

If your business goes "bankrupt"  you are being "bailed out" depending on how you file you will only be responsible for a portion or none of your incurred debt and in some cases can continue to operate your business. Who pays for that? other consumers, business owners and tax payers.

Huh?? If I'm a sole proprietor I'm responsible for my debt until all my assets (including personal) are gone. Any debt left at that point will be be eaten by my creditors , that's true. My creditors took that risk when they decided to do business with me. The government and the taxpayers have no involvement in the process, whatsoever. In GM's case there were a large group of credits who got nothing, called stockholders. Bondholders took a bath as well. "Special" considerations were given the unions, however. Wonder why that was the case?

[BULLITT65]

Well I agree with what you are saying, but was the situation any different when Ford got bailed out in the 80's? When GM got bailed out, if they hadn't, would/could Toyota have come in and worked a deal to buy them?,( kinda like AMF and Harley in the 70's). It may have been hard to watch, but might have been interesting to see how it played out. On one hand  I feel for the workers , on the other I feel the benefits the Union negotiated made it hard for them to turn a profit let alone keep their head above water. Good economy or bad they still have to pay benefits and retirement. When things go good, union can push them into a corner, but when things take a turn for the worse, the company takes a big hit, until they can re-negtiate with the union, (if the company does't go under)

[69Z28-RS]

Well I agree with what you are saying, but was the situation any different when Ford got bailed out in the 80's? When GM got bailed out, if they hadn't, would/could Toyota have come in and worked a deal to buy them?,( kinda like AMF and Harley in the 70's). It may have been hard to watch, but might have been interesting to see how it played out. On one hand  I feel for the workers , on the other I feel the benefits the Union negotiated made it hard for them to turn a profit let alone keep their head above water. Good economy or bad they still have to pay benefits and retirement. When things go good, union can push them into a corner, but when things take a turn for the worse, the company takes a big hit, until they can re-negtiate with the union, (if the company does't go under)

k

IMO, while I'm not a fan of unions in these times, the biggest problems with GM over the last 20-40 yrs has been:  1) Proliferation of different models (how many SUV's do they build now?), 2) Too much inter-division competition within the company (ie. between Chevy/Cad/Pon/Olds/Buick) and too little 'competing' with their real competitors.   Maybe that's what happens when you become 'too big'? and have management with too little 'big picture' perspective.   I'd have preferred to see GM re-organize in such a way as it minimized or eliminated the competition across divisions - but kept all the division names as entire families are (were?) engrained to each of these nameplates.   One way to have done this would be to 'assign' certain classes or models of cars to each division, and let them readjust their identify to match those models, and adjust their attitudes to competing with the Toyotas, Hondas, Fords, Chryslers, Nissans, etc (rather than with one another).   
If they had done that, I think they would have remained the largest car manufacturer in the world, and seen their profits increase.

[janobyte]

I can write a book about my feelings on the systematic "melting" of the Middle Class ,and how one on the stern, one on the bow--while both cast stones ,nobody bothered to check if the ship was taking water until they sunk.

I'm sticking to Camaro's on this thread--neat old 69 ,I agree.

[VINCE Z28]

 The car is in Eugene, Oregon the guy selling is a car flipper ( buys and sells ) the car has some rust around the back window. He has 4 other first gen camaros he is willing to sell. 541-914-1137

[BULLITT65]

so he probably wants some decent coin for each of them so he can make good money.

[KurtS]

If anyone looks at this car, I'd like pics of the trim tag and POP.
Thanks!

[VINCE Z28]

 It's a 3 hour drive one way for me and I'm not in the market at this time. He has 67 rs/ss, 69 plain Jane, 69 SS 350, 69 427 conv. race car. If you want to know more...541-914-1137. You can give him a call.

[KurtS]

I'm still in CR.....

[VINCE Z28]

Kurt, are you interested in buying or just for data base?  If I asked him to email pictures of tags, pop, he might.... P M and let me know. Terry

[68Zproject]

I'm going to keep track of this and put his # in my phone.  My parents live in Roseburg  (when they leave AZ in the spring) and if I go to see them, I'll stop by and take some pics.