Gas tank and heater box markings

[KurtS]

dannystarr had a common sequence number marked on his fire wall (thus by Fisher Body)

Huh?? So Chevrolet couldn't mark anything on the firewall??

[Dave69x33]

169Indy,  I have a copy of the '69 AIM and it does show that the heater core box and fuel tank were both installed on the Chevrolet side, plus after reading the Norwood assembly process report, it does confirm that the Chevrolet operations installed these items.

I have the historical book "Echoes of Norwood" written by Phillip Borris.  Its a great book with diagrams and picture documenting the history of the Norwood operations.  On pages 91 - 92 it explains that a new IBM Series 360 model 40 computer mainframe was used to help increase production build efficiencies at Norwood taking into consideration the work load cycle time required at each step of the assembly process.  It use Fortran programming language that generate punch cards that had to be batch processed 72 hours ahead of each production day. Daily, a Chevrolet data processing operator would deliver to Fisher Body a stack of processed punch cards.  This is how the two plants communicated and coordinated the build schedules per customer dealer orders. The IBM computer system took into account the high option content (RPO content) Camaros, etc. and helped with how high option content Camaros were release from the body bank, at the beginning of the Chevrolet side of the assembly operations.  The book along with the assembly report on the CRG website explain further how the trimmed out body shells from Fisher Body were received in the body bank, and how Chevrolet released them in to a "lock in" build sequence. 

Pertinent to the topic how sequence numbers were incorporated, the Echoes of Norwood book explains that an operator operating a large console in the Chevrolet body bank would "enter the production sequence number expressed as the daily unit build number tabulation number 001 through unit 999 for a given day", repeating again each day.  The console operator also entered the body identification number from trim plate installed by Fisher Body (shown on a body and chassis broadcast sheets as the "ident. number).  The VIN numbers were assigned sequentially and the last 6-digits of the VIN were entered in the computer system and included on the printed broadcast sheets.  The IBM computer system could automatically reject a portion of the vehicle build if plant inventories would not support the build.  The body bank (called out as a cycle bank) operator had the option to override the computer and release the vehicle with the understanding that it would be completed in a repair bay.  Based on my experience in automotive powertrain operations, you DO NOT shut down an automotive assembly plant, considered the "cash cow" of any automotive industrial operation!

The Echoes of Norwood book goes on to explain that once the build sequence was approved, the production scheduling of each vehicle, all the component parts, options and accessories were sent by the IBM computer teletype system instantly to update the build order and thus coordinated all the assembly departments with the main line.  At that point the body bank operator released the body that matched the "IBM selected vehicle assembly build sequence. As noted earlier, each body was then locked in the assembly process. It would only be moved out of its build sequence if a repair was necessary.

The CRG report along with the Echoes of Norwood book show bodies with body broadcast sheets taped to the body firewall area, and eventually relocating the body broadcast sheet to front inside area of the windshield next to the chassis broad case sheet. See example pictures below of the broadcast sheets. The book explains that initially, operators were resistant to change referring to a computer generated paper broadcast sheet rather than to the trim tag.  For a period of time, the body trim plate was painted white to make it easier to see the major option content.

At some point, the operators, engineers, and plant management on both the Fisher Body and Chevrolet sides of the Norwood operations must of agreed on marking the sequence number on the firewall by Fisher Body, and on the lower from valance as a completed front sheet metal subassembly by Chevrolet.  Dannystarr's pictures clearly show this.  Sequence markings on the body firewall would have been more clearly legible to operators as the body progress down the assembly line, and pull the correct parts for that specific car.  A sequence number printed on a broadcast sheet would have been hard to read taped to the firewall and/or inside the front windshield.

Sorry for the long discussion on the Norwood assembly operations.  I feel its important to understand the Norwood assembly operations and methods to gain a better understanding how the "vehicle's" sequence number was used, both by Fisher Body and Chevrolet, and what other components the sequence number was written on:  i.e. heater core boxes, fuel tanks, wheel rims/spare tire rims, etc.   

The body broadcast sheet is from a friend's '69 RS Camaro.

If anyone has pictures of their Camaro during a restoration showing all the parts that had the sequence number written on them, I would love to see them!
   

[dannystarr]

What about multiple numbers? I have a car with stamps 49... 63... 130... 131... 452... Maybe a couple more. How would we know if Fischer or Chevrolet stamped them? Does it depend on the location? ... Danny

[Dave69x33]

Danny,

Are all those numbers on the same car(s)?

Are there different numbers marked on various parts on the same car?

Based on the CRG assembly process report, other than the semi-finished body shells that were being delivered by Fisher Body, most of the parts would have been marked on the Chevrolet side where they were installed.

Dave

[Dave69x33]

For clarification, here is a summary what the Fisher Body completed before the “shell” was delivered to The Chevrolet options:

“Trim Shop: Installs wiring, glass and moldings, weatherstrips, door and deck lid hardware, interior and exterior trim, taillights, moldings and emblems, headliner, seats and rear carpets, water tests, and ships the trimmed body to Chevrolet.”

[GMAD_Van Nuys]

Although I worked at the Van Nuys Plant, beginning in 1978, it is my understanding that efficiency was measured based on the labor standards calculated by industrial engineering for someone to perform a given task on the assembly line.  As GMAD Van Nuys was a 2 story facility and the standards were based on a one story plant, there was an adjustment made (realization factor, if I recall correctly) and after daily production was concluded, an efficiency report was transmitted to Central Office.  Our scheduling department had some say when we received a build schedule from Central Office, but in the end, we only built cars according to the schedule from Central Office.   

[Dave69x33]

GMAD_Van Nuys,

Interesting! I worked as a manufacturing/process engineer during 1985 - 1998 at the former Allison Gas Turbine (AGT) Division of GM in Indianapolis, IN. I was there when it was sold and eventually landed with Rolls-Royce Aerospace.  I recall the Industrial Engineers under AGT also had labor standards; however, due to the low volume/high revenue per unit aerospace business, it was hard to hold production to strict standard labor hours.  Some individual gas turbine parts took weeks to manufacture!  Aerospace parts are very expensive, involve very specialize manufacturing processes, so rework is common an often done to salvage parts. 

I left AGT/Rolls-Royce to help project manage and help launch two new Chrysler Transmission Plants in Kokomo, IN. These powertrain plants were very high volume (3200 and 1600 transmission per day), and operated under a completely different business model from aerospace.  Labor standards were important but most all the fabrication lines were automated that used conveyors, pick-and-place units, robots, robotic vision, and palletized conveyors to transfer parts between operations. For the past 11 years I have work as a manufacturing project engineer at Allison Transmission in Indianapolis.  We make a wide range of heavy duty automatic transmission for school buses, UPS/FedEx style trucks, ambulances, dump trucks, cement mixers, the tow trucks that push jets from the jet way, fire trucks, as well as off-road mining trucks and equipment. Allison also still make the transmissions for the M1 Abrams battle tanks!

All told, most all GM, Ford, Chrysler plants "back in the day" as well as today along with many other modern manufacturing plants, use work place organization and visual based controls for the operators to get the "status at a glance" condition of parts, part placement, quality indicators, etc. 

When I read the book Echoes of Norwood Plant, aspects of Norwood reminded me of AGT!  I can just imaging how challenging it must have been to implement a new computer system with printed broadcast sheets taped on cars for the workers to follow.  I can just imaging that a portion of the workforce asked (revolted, complained, pushed management) for a simple sequence number to be marked on the body so they could quickly see and pull the correct parts for the car as it progress thru assembly.  Some parts must have been marked with the corresponding sequence number, while other parts had broadcast sheet or some sort of sequence number sheet taped to them.  The Echoes of Norwood book shows the taped sheet on the rear axle assemblies and front sub frame assemblies.     

[GMAD_Van Nuys]

I remember when someone from industrial engineering would go out into the assembly plant with a stop watch and do a time study on an operation.  When I was at Van Nuys, you basically had about a minute to perform your operation and most of the work was not easy.  The plant was also not air conditioned and it would get really hot in the summer, especially on the second floor where we used water-based paint.

I left GM and went to McDonnell Douglas in Long Beach, CA.  I had to submit the Program Cost Estimate to the Air Force for the C-17, which was based on actuals, standards, realization factors, out-of-position work, etc.  I had an spreadsheet which had inputs for touch labor and sustaining effort and would have to manual change the lot break points, based on requests from the Air Force for future production lot buy scenarios.  I got really good changing learning curves and doing parametric estimates as during the early days of the C-17, there was a concern about unit cost, mostly due to budget constraints.  I don't believe we ever produced more than 16 C-17s in any production lot, even though the assembly plant, Bldg. 54, was designed to produce over 24 planes.  I laugh when I hear what a great the C-17 is as when I was on the Lot 4, 5, and 6 negotiation team, we were always being told the program was going to be cancelled!

I have to admit I liked working more at GM.  When I visited the plant at Bowling Green, they didn't stop the line when changing shifts as the assembly line moved so slowly that it wasn't necessary!

[dannystarr]

  Danny,
 
Are all those numbers on the same car(s)?    Numbers posted are from the same car.

Are there different numbers marked on various parts on the same car?      Yes and No   The 49 and the 63 are a foot and a half from each other on the side of the left frame rail. All other numbers are a different locations.   Danny

[samz]

Example of heater box ,and spare on my Norwood  69 Z/28.

[Dave69x33]

samz,

Thanks for your post!  Looks like you have "47" written on your heater box and spare tire.  What is your VIN No. and the trim tag build date of your Norwood '69Z?  Curious to see how close it might be to my VIN "N638712" 05A Norwood build '69Z.  If your car has not been restored, is there any noticeable similar marking on your firewall or on the inside lower front valance panel?

jnobyte's '68Z has "10" marked on his heater box and spare tire, so maybe we can start to see a pattern!

dannystar share common markings on his firewall and lower inside front valance panel.

That is the reason I will ask for trim tag build dates and partial VIN numbers to try and associate a time period with the practice of marking components targeted to specific Camaros.  VINs and build dates may also help correlate when Norwood launched their IBM computer system and use of printed broadcast build sheets, the use of daily unit build "tabulation numbers" or the "sequence" number printed on the build sheets, and perhaps markings on components.

[samz]

Dave,
  There are no similar markings on the firewall or lower front valance panel. The gas tank does have a number that is hard to read, it does not appear to be 47.
  VIN #NOR160115 10E X33 trim, unrestored.
  let me know if you need anything else, happy to help.