Originality?

[hrlyfxdl]

So, forgive me if I'm speaking about something addressed before. I am relatively new to the life of actually owning a Camaro, although been hooked ever since I was 5 when my aunt would take me cruising at night in her 68 while she babysat me. As I am working on my car (and although not very educated, loving every minute of it), when I take something apart on the car to clean it, or replace/repair it, I want to put it back together as accurately as possible as a tribute to originality. That's just what I appreciate and like to see. Not really into drastic mods.

Has there ever been thought to putting together an archive of just photos, maybe verified by a few select highly educated and respected individuals on this site, that show original color schemes, bolts, designs, patterns, markings, etc? Or is it just simpler to search through the multiple strings that have been collected over the years of this site to find those images and discussion points? I bought all the books I was recommended too from an earlier post, great reading and highly educational, but many have either B/W photos or drawings, so discerning color and detail is challenging.

I've seen the section on here of original cars and I have gone through every post, but still wish they were more in depth in the images or maybe just all in one place. Maybe I'm just that newbie hungry for information, IDK. Anyway, thanks for the information and would appreciate thoughts about this. Heck, it just may be logistically impossible due to the amount of deviations and storage it'd take for all those photos, anyway just thinking. Thanks.

[ko-lek-tor]

You say you have read much. Surely you have read about "normative practice"? These cars are not " cookie cutter" built and there is no one way only to correctly restore a Camaro.  There were 2 plants, many, many engineering changes throughout the production cycle. Parts differences from early to late model year of production, substitutions on the line caused by shortages. There are a plethora of known normative practices "differences" throughout each year of production and as many anomalies. Sometimes several pictures are submitted to get a sampling of how a part or process was done. Each car has its own nuances giving individuality to it' s owner. Like a pet, everyone recognizes a dog is a dog, but not all dogs are the same. That may be an over simplification of these cars, regardless, for judging purposes, to conform, some anomalies are noted, some changed or corrected during restoration. The purist wants to stay true and accurate, so documents and takes pictures of each known original component and restores them to "as found" noting paint variances, nomenclature etc... Most of all, enjoyment comes in doing the restoration process and the research that results in accurate representations. After 50 years, new information still surfaces and interest in this marquee persists.

[69Z28-RS]

that said, you can learn an awful lot about the combinations that the factory built by perusing the CRG archives:
http://www.camaros.org/index.shtml

Once you've done that, and think you 'have it', you'll find that you will come back to it many times as you peruse the threads and questions raised by people on the forum...  In those threads is where you will find many more photos of owner's cars and parts.

Good luck..

[janobyte]

You want in depth: go to Team Camaro and look up Chick's 68 Z/28 build thread. And, just about anybody else building these have posted this and that over the years. There is a mass amount of information on this site that has been accumulated over many years. I have an old desktop in my shop dedicated to just reference. Articles and pics dedicated to certain areas of the car. Documentation in form of pics of my numbers, before and after shots. Then add to it Jerry M's book, the 68 assembly manual, 68 Motor manual, Chassis Service Manual. This being a car I've been around since 76 and consider simple. Sort of a vent to my obsessive personality!

[bcmiller]

So, forgive me if I'm speaking about something addressed before. I am relatively new to the life of actually owning a Camaro, although been hooked ever since I was 5 when my aunt would take me cruising at night in her 68 while she babysat me. As I am working on my car (and although not very educated, loving every minute of it), when I take something apart on the car to clean it, or replace/repair it, I want to put it back together as accurately as possible as a tribute to originality. That's just what I appreciate and like to see. Not really into drastic mods.

Has there ever been thought to putting together an archive of just photos, maybe verified by a few select highly educated and respected individuals on this site, that show original color schemes, bolts, designs, patterns, markings, etc? Or is it just simpler to search through the multiple strings that have been collected over the years of this site to find those images and discussion points? I bought all the books I was recommended too from an earlier post, great reading and highly educational, but many have either B/W photos or drawings, so discerning color and detail is challenging.

I've seen the section on here of original cars and I have gone through every post, but still wish they were more in depth in the images or maybe just all in one place. Maybe I'm just that newbie hungry for information, IDK. Anyway, thanks for the information and would appreciate thoughts about this. Heck, it just may be logistically impossible due to the amount of deviations and storage it'd take for all those photos, anyway just thinking. Thanks.

Your request would be a huge task. Best thing to do is take pics of what you have BEFORE you take it apart in case you have questions when you put it back together. And of course search through the thousands of threads posted over the years by using the Search feature. Ask questions if you run into problems.

[68camaroz28]

You want in depth: go to Team Camaro and look up Chick's 68 Z/28 build thread. And, just about anybody else building these have posted this and that over the years. There is a mass amount of information on this site that has been accumulated over many years. I have an old desktop in my shop dedicated to just reference. Articles and pics dedicated to certain areas of the car. Documentation in form of pics of my numbers, before and after shots. Then add to it Jerry M's book, the 68 assembly manual, 68 Motor manual, Chassis Service Manual. This being a car I've been around since 76 and consider simple. Sort of a vent to my obsessive personality!

X2- LOL my (Chick's) build thread- http://www.camaros.net/forums/133-build-projects/182584-time-another-68-z-28-restored.html
What everyone is stating is correct and even though there are differences in cars there is a norm of what is normally noted on original cars. What our Camaro Hobby needs is a NCRS type approach where people can purchase a judging manual which supplies much of the information people need and want to more accurately restore their car back to what is currently considered correct. Note I wrote "currently" as NCRS judging manuals are updated every so many years as information is uncovered. We are fortunate to have a great number of people who share their information and have assisted the hobby immensely. One who comes to mind instantly is JohnZ (Hinckley) and there are many others but we also have where judging for Camaro owners could be improved by having some type of judging manual and not based solely on a judges personal opinion. This is not meant to diminish the difficult task of judging but only to relish the hope someday we could approach to have some type of general judging manual which could be used by anyone also restoring a first gen Camaro. I have given thoughts of putting something like this together on what I have learned restoring our 68 but as Bryon noted it's a huge task and needs to be a team effort.

[janobyte]

Even at that, getting into the details, there are opinion based presentations. Using my car for example: the center link. To accurately replicate the inspection marks, well just would have looked awful.( it did look awful to me, re-did it) I have never seen pics, or in person,  a car with so much paint on the ends, etc. Doing a Day 2, affords some liberties anyhow. 

Some like over spray, some not.

Personally, I feel the data's out there for the taking if one wants to build a "points" car. Colors, numbers. They will send you the sheet used for judging. Takes a little effort.

End result, most probably look better then when they rolled off the line, as theses were mass produced. Mine was covered with about 5 gallons of undercoat, via the dealer. lol.

BTY: Really like the Restoguard. Even used it on our wrought iron deck furniture yesterday. Happy wife.

[BULLITT65]

You say you have read much. Surely you have read about "normative practice"? These cars are not " cookie cutter" built and there is no one way only to correctly restore a Camaro.  There were 2 plants, many, many engineering changes throughout the production cycle. Parts differences from early to late model year of production, substitutions on the line caused by shortages. There are a plethora of known normative practices "differences" throughout each year of production and as many anomalies. Sometimes several pictures are submitted to get a sampling of how a part or process was done. Each car has its own nuances giving individuality to it' s owner. Like a pet, everyone recognizes a dog is a dog, but not all dogs are the same. That may be an over simplification of these cars, regardless, for judging purposes, to conform, some anomalies are noted, some changed or corrected during restoration. The purist wants to stay true and accurate, so documents and takes pictures of each known original component and restores them to "as found" noting paint variances, nomenclature etc... Most of all, enjoyment comes in doing the restoration process and the research that results in accurate representations. After 50 years, new information still surfaces and interest in this marquee persists.

I agree with Bentley, there are so many anomalies even at the same plant, switching parts suppliers, and the way the cars were put together in the beginning of the year, vs. price changes and options added or removed during the year.
You could find a bone stock 68 that was built at a different time of the year as yours and some things would be different than the way your car may have been delivered.
IMO, there is not any 1 expert that knows it all, or has seen it all. The best thing you can do is try to find a un-restored or original car(s) built the same time as yours and then document as much you can. You will end up with some good data, and the more cars you find built around your car and the more data points, will lead you to higher probability conclusions of how your car was built.
Every build month has its own little details, and the deeper you go the more info you will turn up.
I am still surprised after 40 years to still see new findings turn up on these cars.

[KurtS]

But your point was the concept behind the "Original Cars and Details" section.
It's not limited to pretty survivors, but cars (and details) that are original. New posts can be by car or by feature (e.g. cowl paint).